How to Evaluate a Cell Tower Lease Buyout Like an Investor | Ep 83

Speaker: Selling a cell tower lease is a lot like selling the roof on your home while keeping the rest, and it can work out really well if you know what you're doing, which is what we're gonna talk about today on the Furlo Capital Real Estate Podcast because I am in the middle of some of these discussions and it is crazy interesting of this world of cell tower leases.

And our goal in this conversation is to help equip you to invest wisely. And so that. Yeah, invest wisely so that we can invest in, so that we can build wealth and improve housing at the same time. Oh my gosh. I'm on a streak. I like, I literally just practiced it before we got on. It was totally fine, but that's okay.

That's what it is. You

Speaker 2: can do like a Anyways take.

Speaker: This is, I am James and this is my wife, Jessi.

Speaker 2: I was actually hoping that we were gonna talk about how puppy training is like real estate. Oh yeah. Because that's all I can think about right now. In the middle of puppy training, we just did puppy class.

My head is exploding with, oh my gosh. Like the most impressive thing. This has nothing to do with anything podcast related. Okay. Well maybe it does. I don't know. The most impressive thing was. The teacher, like has a dog, obviously, and she's been doing classes for 20 years or whatever, and like she flexes at one point.

Mm-hmm. And is just like, yeah, look what you could get to people. Yeah. And the dog's just like, she's like, sit back up, stay, lay down, tidy up your toys. And it does like the dog roll over all roll over. Yeah. Yeah. It was cool. All the things. It was very cool. My like, Eleanor was just like. What? I didn't even know dogs could do that.

Yeah. I'm just happy that, that's amazing that our

Speaker: puppy. Walks around the block without a le stays with us. Like that's pretty fun that he comes, when we call it, he plays fetch, so, you know. Yeah. But yeah, my,

Speaker 3: my bar is a little lower, which is totally cool. Doing a bunch of tricks. But

Speaker: yeah. I am currently in a situation where I'm learning that my bar needs to be higher than what, what is normal.

I can't give a lot of details about the deal 'cause there's regulations all around it. Interesting. But I wanna talk about one aspect of this deal, which. Involves some cell tower leases. So looking at this building to buy it and it has some cell towers mm-hmm. On top of it. And I have been learning so much about it and I just, part of this is me externally processing everything about it.

Just kinda sharing what's been going. So for this particular building, there are two cell towers that are on it. One of which is at t. Mm-hmm. The other is US Cellular.

Speaker 4: Okay.

Speaker: One of the things I've recently learned okay. So. They, so these two companies essentially got a lease for part of the building to build their cell towers and then they pay a monthly fee.

So

Speaker 2: it's not like they're, it's not like they own the roof or own part of the building. Correct. It's as if the, the roof were an apartment and they're leasing that uhhuh space.

Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: Interesting.

Speaker: Yeah. Or not an apartment, but like an office building or industrial building or something like that.

Okay. And

Speaker 2: then they just so happen to use it to put their cell towers on. Correct. 'cause it's high.

Speaker: Correct. Yeah, exactly. There you go. Yeah. So it turns out that there are companies that are willing to buy those leases.

Speaker 2: So why?

Speaker: I haven't fully figured that out yet. Because

Speaker 2: currently, or, or, or the way that it typically would work is like the building owner would have the lease with the cell company Uhhuh.

Speaker: Yep.

Speaker 2: So it would be a third party company?

Speaker: Correct. That. So the idea, the lease with that idea. So yeah. So essentially what it is, is they buy an easement to the roof and so weird, I own the building. Yeah. But they essentially control the roof and everything on the roof, including any leases that might be associated with the roof.

Speaker 2: What's the benefit of the building owner to do that?

Speaker: They give you a lot of money up front,

Speaker 2: well up front, but then ongoing you. Lose the money that you would get from the leases.

Speaker: Yeah, yeah, that's true. But with the time value of money, it's, it's more valuable to potentially get it up front than it is to wait the 20 to 40 years to collect the funds.

Speaker 3: Interesting.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker 3: Hmm.

Speaker: Now, so what some of the companies do, if they're smaller they'll buy it from you and then they'll roll them all up into a bigger package and then they'll resell that package of cell tower leases to other really big companies. Got it. So it's like

Speaker 2: lease or cell towers on multiple buildings with multiple leases, correct?

Correct. And they just kind of bundle it altogether? Correct,

Speaker: yeah. Or they've got some sort of economies of scale that they can do where their profitability is better, they can buy it from me at retail and essentially. Operate as if it's wholesale. 'cause they have a bunch of stuff that kind of makes

Speaker 2: sense.

You know, for example, if you had one property and you were going to manage many others. It's a, it's a, yeah, a scale issue. Yeah. Yeah. So it's like, okay, if we have 50 of these things, the maintenance like on one is the same as on 50. Yeah. So we can hire a guy, or another way they do it for is essentially

Speaker: they buy it at, from what I can tell, it's like a 12 to 15% discount.

Speaker 4: Oh.

Speaker: And so, I mean, you don't see that money until the end. Right. But they're like, Hey, we're in it for a long term. They're gonna hold onto it forever or whatever. Yeah. And that's where they go, yeah. We make 12% on our money. It's what it is.

Speaker 2: That's super interesting.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker 2: I had no idea that was a business.

Speaker: Me neither.

Me neither. Okay.

Speaker 2: Doesn't it I'm wondering if it causes a problem for the business. Well, for the property owner. Okay. To be working, like, to not have control or, or to lose access. I, I guess you don't lose access, you just grant access. To this third party company, are there rules lose about like lose access?

What do

you

Speaker: mean by that?

Speaker 2: Well, like let's say you had a roof leak or something. Yeah. Like you've gotta go repair that. Correct. Does the lease of the cell tower like prohibit you from getting on there at different times or? It depends on how it's

Speaker: written. Sometimes they are in charge of the roof.

Sometimes I'm still in charge of it. Like I'm still in charge of everything below, like making sure the building

Speaker 2: stands and stands and does all the things. Good conditions. Sure. Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. But depending on how it's written, yeah. Maybe they take care of the roof for you. You don't get paid as much, but you know, whatever.

Speaker 2: Huh. Alright, so it's, there's negotiation, just like any lease. Oh, a hundred percent. Yeah. For what They're responsible for. What you're responsible for.

Speaker: Yep. Yeah. Huh. Now my, my plan is to use this lump sum payment as part of the down payment for purchasing this property. Okay. So I don't have to necessarily raise as much.

Yeah. It's, it's actually cheaper for me to sell the lease than it is to raise the funds.

Speaker 2: Okay.

Speaker: Because they, that, that kind of makes sense. Want a 12% return, whereas investors, that's like the minimum.

Speaker 2: Does the potential exist in the future to buy the leases back? I mean, that sounds weird, but,

Speaker: I am, I am asking about that.

Interesting. No. In general, like they have to be willing to sell it and they usually don't. Right. And they

Speaker 2: typically,

Speaker: they're, unless there's reason for if it's big company,

Speaker 2: they could hold onto it.

Speaker: For now, one of the things I'm asking for is a first rider of refusal to buy that if they ever do decide to sell.

Yeah. To at least gimme a shot to, to buy it back. I may not, but I'm like, Hey man, at least you know, gimme the courtesy of gimme know, keeping it with me. Me. Yeah. Letting me know that's gonna work. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

Speaker 2: So it does seem like it has levels of complication that are just like. Oh my gosh. Like what?

Why are we making this so complicated? Like on one level, on one hand it seems so straightforward. Yeah. It's like, we wanna rent your roof. We're gonna put a tower on it.

Speaker: Yep.

Speaker 2: It's super straightforward, but on another level it's like,

Speaker: well, so that part's already happened. Right, right. But it's hap Yeah, it and that part's, its already, and that part's really straightforward.

Right? It's, that seems straightforward. I own a spot, I'll w rent you the spot. No big deal.

Speaker 2: Which I guess, I guess you just have to wrap your head around it as like, okay, you're becoming the new property owner. You are, you are going to, essentially this third party company is your tenant. Mm-hmm. They're buying the leases.

Correct? Yes. That's the way, that's a great way to think about it. They, they're now ooc occupying, right? The roof,

Speaker: right? Yes, yes, yes. And instead of them paying like a monthly rental fee, they just go, we'll pay you a bunch of money up front. Pay you

Speaker 2: all up front. And then we get access and get to use, and then they do their thing.

Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah. Yep. That's how I think about it. Hmm. There's, there's other places in the industry where this kind of happens, like for example. I like, maybe you get a loan from me. Okay. And you're making regular payments? Mm-hmm. To me, and I'm like, you know, I'm getting 'em over time, but maybe something happens where I'm like, man, I could really use the cash front.

Speaker 4: Yeah.

Speaker: I can then take that note and I can sell it to a third party person and now you don't pay me anymore. You now pay this third party person. And they just gave me a chunk of cash up front.

Speaker 2: Okay.

Speaker: So there might be something like, I don't know, we'll keep the numbers simple. I, I gave you a hundred thousand dollars loan you're making.

I don't know, whatever, a thousand dollars payments, right? Mm-hmm. Which is gonna take forever to pay off. Right? And I'm just like, months, I'm not, I'm not willing to wait forever. Mm-hmm. And so maybe I go to this person, Hey, I'll sell you this, this note for 75,000. And they go, yep. Love it.

Speaker 4: Oh, now

Speaker: they slowly collect that thousand dollars over time, but there's a guaranteed profit of 25 grand.

Now whole again, time value, money is a thing, and so that 75 may or may not make sense given all the parameters, blah, blah, blah.

Speaker 4: Okay.

Speaker: But it's, it's a very similar idea to that there's just this asset that's also part of it. It's

Speaker 2: essentially your saying you think it's more valuable long term to take the cash now and reinvest it in a, in something else in this property, yes.

So that. Your profits can be better essentially in the future.

Speaker: Uhhuh. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2: Huh. How do you, how do you do that math? Like, 'cause I, I mean, you have, you obviously know how much this third party company's willing to pay for the leases. Correct. And you know how much they were currently being leased for.

Correct. So I guess you could compare both scenarios, which

Speaker: is exactly what I did. Yeah.

Speaker 2: Huh.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker 2: And then, and, and then. It is inevitably different if you have a lump sum of money versus a little bit over time. Correct? Yes. So your decision making on, like for example, putting the lump sum towards the purchase price, like that's different.

Yeah. Mm-hmm. The property's more expensive. Yep. Without it, even though you might make more month by month, but spread out. Yeah. So what it does, so over a long time, like

Speaker: the big thing is that it actually changes the value of the building, right? Once you get the cash. You give up that future cash flow. So the, the NOI of the building, the net operating income is now less.

Right. And so I need to, I needed to factor in, not just, Hey, I'm not gonna get that money anymore. I'll actually sell the bus. The building will be worth less in the future than if I had this contract still in place. Mm-hmm. Because essentially you're giving up some cash flow.

Speaker 2: Hmm. But hopefully you do improvements or other things to make it more valuable.

Speaker: Yeah. And yeah. And the numbers gotta make sense. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. And it's just, it's in some ways it's a spreadsheet exercise. Hmm. So couple interesting tidbits. US Cellular is under contract to be bought by T-Mobile.

Speaker 2: Okay.

Speaker: And so one of the things I learned in this process is that none of these third party people want to buy cellular.

'cause there's all these unknowns around it. Oh

Speaker 4: yeah.

Speaker: So like for at and t, they're willing to pay a 24 to 25 x multiple for it. Mm-hmm. We know which is. Which is good. Yeah. Whereas there they're more like, we'll give you five, like it's like nothing. Wow. To the point where we're not even interested because there's a high probability T-Mobile, well, there's a probability with, especially in this area where T-Mobile has other towers in the area.

Oh be, so the question is, will they consolidate? We're not interesting and no one knows. And so when you don't know, you go, oh, I'm not interested in buying.

Speaker 2: And so if, if the cell tower is consolidated, they could potentially drop that

Speaker: correct. Lease. Correct. Because they're like, we don't need a tower there anymore.

They don renew. We're just gonna do one the future. Yep. Yeah.

Speaker 2: Which that third party company could find another. Cell provider. Yeah. But

Speaker: that costs money and you know, time and energy, and it's not uncertain and the, and what I learned is that the equipment is not interchangeable. Oh. So you could resell the

Speaker 2: space, but they'd have to put a whole new system in.

Speaker: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Interesting. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2: Wow.

Speaker: Yeah, it's super fascinating. You never knew, whereas had this transaction been happening, I think it was like three years ago. Mm-hmm. They would've bought both.

Speaker 2: Oh. And it

Speaker: would've been worth,

Speaker 2: because T-Mobile wasn't in the game yet.

Speaker: Yeah, yeah. Who would've known.

Yeah, super interesting. So some of that, like there's some gambling that happens there as well. I'm like, oh man. Interesting. Other things, so these, they're, they're technically, they're, they're, they're buying an easement, right? Which is essentially saying, Hey, we want long-term access to this thing.

Yeah. But not all of 'em are equal. Some of them are willing to give, it's like a 50 or 55 year. They only want a 50 or 55 year easement. Some of 'em want 99 years, essentially twice as much. Yeah. That's one of the things there is like why does

Speaker 2: the timeline matter?

Speaker: It, it's

Speaker 2: a long time no matter what.

Speaker: Yeah. It depends again, for Sellability, right? Let's say I hold onto this building for 20 years, there's a big difference between saying, oh, there's only 30 years left on this, versus saying, oh, there's 70 years left.

Speaker 2: Yes, it's be for the rest of your life.

Speaker: And so it's like, it's not a lot more valuable, but it's a little bit more valuable.

Yeah. There is, like I said, there's that, that overall number. Also, these companies are willing to give you payments over time. So they might give you a lump sum, but you could also say, eh, let's spread it out over 10 years. And because of the whole time value of money, they're willing to pay you more for the contract over 10 years.

'cause it doesn't cost them money front to do it. Mm-hmm. Sense. So there's, that makes sense. That's another like little piece to this. Another thing that I learned. Is I got notes here of what makes them different. Oh, there's, there's different levels of restrictiveness to the easement. Like I said, maybe they go, we'll take care of the roof and all this stuff.

Speaker 2: Right.

Speaker: Maybe they won't, some of them have restrictions on me being able to compete with them. Like they might say, Hey, you've got an easement, but if you own another property in town, you can't build a cell tower within a mile of ours, or something like that.

Speaker 2: Wow.

Speaker: Something.

Speaker 2: Yeah, whatever.

Speaker: Yeah. You know, obviously our, our interests are all aligned on that kind of thing, you know, but but yeah, there's, there's different levels of restrictiveness.

Speaker 2: Are there restrictions on how many cell towers can be on top of your property?

Speaker: As long as the city allows it. No. Huh. Yeah. That's another one that I've noticed almost everybody includes. Is there some sort of, once they have an easement, in theory, they can go find new cell tower contracts. I don't really have space on mine, so it doesn't matter, but.

If they did find someone, they'd do a 50 50 revenue split. Oh, in the future. Yeah.

Speaker 2: So, because as far as they're concerned,

Speaker: like the hard part's been done, right, the, the, the structure's already been built. It's already there. So they're willing to share that. Yeah. So there's

Speaker 2: a potential.

Speaker: Potential other stream of income.

Yes. If

Speaker 2: they expand. So now the

Speaker: weird part about it is, and this is where it actually might work out, potentially, well for me, like if US Cellular goes away, we then get a deal with Verizon or something and they go, yeah, cool, you can have 50 50 at Verizon. So it's not a horrible situation, not ideal, but

Speaker 2: yeah, it's not deal for, for them.

I'd

Speaker: rather think a hundred percent of and and they're willing to even say, and you know what, 50 50 split. We'll, we'll give you a lump sum for that as well if you want. They'll just keep a hundred. So there's all like, there's all sorts of stuff that you can do. So in theory that could happen and that could go, Hey investors, here's another $200,000.

Cool.

Speaker 2: Weird. So weird.

Speaker: Or the T-Mobile thing gets all fixed out, you know, gets, gets finalized and T-Mobile goes, yeah, we're gonna keep it. No big deal. Then they suddenly go, cool, this has value, now we're willing to buy it now.

Speaker 2: Hmm.

Speaker: And so

Speaker 2: is that how. Is that how other business leases work in properties?

Let's say you have like a commercial level on the bottom. I don't think so. And like no residential and stuff. This is different. It's different.

Speaker: Yeah. I mean, I'm sure there are other stuff I would imagine like oil fields and things like that are very similar. I know McDonald's used to buy the land and then give a lease to.

The franchisee.

Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: And, and then they would build and do all that stuff I've talked about. So it happens with land contracts a lot, where like maybe you have someone who goes, well, I don't wanna buy the land, but I also don't wanna get kicked out in five years, so gimme a 20 to 50 year lease on this thing with automatic ratchets and all that kind of stuff.

Yeah. So like you've, you've seen some things, things like that. And that's especially true if they're, they're investing a lot of capital into. Whatever it is. Whatever business it is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then I guess if those are the situations, then you could have someone who comes along and says, yeah, I'm willing to buy it for a lump sum.

Speaker 3: Sure.

Speaker: And get a guaranteed return over the long haul. My investors are happy 'cause it's low risk, we've got the capital to do it, whatever. Yeah. Let's see, what else? Did I learn? Oh, this one's a new one. So there are some companies where you buy it and it's as straightforward as I just said, others who go.

Yes, we're gonna buy it for that much, but we're gonna actually withhold the first four months payments as kind of a repayment type of thing for the transaction costs and whatever. Huh. Which I was like,

Speaker 2: okay.

Speaker: Oh, so it's not that amount like

Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like at a mountain minus your cost. Four months of rent.

Speaker: Yeah. Super weird. I don't. I think they do that so that it's a weird, it's like the airplane stuff where they can show you a higher number and go, oh, we can get you this big number. I mean, minus some of this here. So it's actually like, so on paper it seems like it's higher, but in reality you're like, no, this is actually a lower offer.

What are you talking about? And so that was, if that was a surprise on me, like yep, some of 'em do that. And you really don't find that out until you get your letter of intent. Huh. For it, which at that

Speaker 2: point you're, you're still reviewing it and could accept or deny, correct. Yeah. And that's

Speaker: what I have right now.

I have multiple letters of intent and I'm going through looking at those. I also have the actual easement or sample easement documents that they'll be going off of. That we'll be talking about. So there's

Speaker 2: multiple of these third party companies. Oh my

Speaker: gosh. Yeah. Well I've been talking five of them and there's my word, there's dozens.

Speaker 2: Do they, so do they get like into bidding wars and stuff? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just like, oh my gosh. Just like

Speaker: normal stuff. Well, and it's, and that's actually been, so I was

Speaker 2: under the impression you were talking to and company No. And negotiating back and forth. I started by talking

Speaker: to five, narrowed it down to two.

Oh my word and, and it's weird 'cause like they talk about similar things, but the language is slightly different. And so here's one of my learnings that I've got when buying a cell tower lease. Ask for as much information as you can upfront. Don't just rely on the phone conversations.

Speaker 4: Hmm.

Speaker: Ask them, say, Hey, I actually want a written letter of intent.

Do the details, show me some sample documents mm-hmm. Of what this is actually gonna look like when it's all said and done. And what was the, oh. And then spend the time reviewing their website and about the company just to figure out where they're at. Yeah. Like there's some where this is 100% what they do, they spend like, they're specialized in this.

Yeah. There's others where they're more like broad investors and this is a part of their portfolio, but they invest in other stuff like say notes and bigger buildings and whatever. Some of them are us only, some of them go international, right? And some of 'em have massive three and a half billion dollar funds.

Some of 'em are a little bit smaller, and so you like. Do your due diligence to, like, again, phone calls are good, they're really important, they're sales calls. Mm-hmm. And so a big part of what you need to do is ask for all that documentation, just so you can review it and compare it. Yeah. And see what's actually up.

That makes sense. Because I had a couple situations where like there was one where website, super educational, really good phone conversations, super polite, super nice. They told me a bunch of stuff, sounded really good. I got their letter of intent and there were things in there where I went. Oh, that's, we never talked about that.

That that seems material to me. Like that four month clawback piece. Right. Or or the other ones that I've learned is some of 'em are like, here's the number, this is the number, deal with it. Mm-hmm. Others? No, it's a no negotiation. Like if you come back and say, man, I kind of wish it was a little higher.

They go, okay, tell me more. Like, what are you looking to get out of it?

Speaker 2: Interesting.

Speaker: Yeah. So it's not

Speaker 2: just a flat.

Speaker: Yeah. And so fee or whatever, which. It's hard 'cause United States people don't like to negotiate and, and like, and it's just, for me it was this light bulb like, oh, I get it. This is like a real estate.

This isn't negotiation. This isn't just a number. Like, I can't push back. I can't ask for more. I can't see where they're at. And you know, they're like, oh, I gotta take it back to my underwriting department and, you know, whatever. Which is fine.

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker: But yeah, it's it is a complicated process. I have no idea.

See.

Speaker 2: Does your building have to have certain qualifications, like height and size to have cell tower, a cell tower?

Speaker: Probably. I don't actually know much about that side of things because this already has it, so I didn't go out. But I've gotta imagine they've gotta have some sort of expectation for coverage on it, in which case they're like, yeah, no, this one qualifies.

Yeah. For it. Oh. Other things that matter is how fast it can close. So there's, there's two things you can do, like if you already own it mm-hmm. It actually gets. It's more complicated if you already own it and then try to sell it after the fact. It turns out because this easement needs to supersede anything that the bank might have as a lien against it.

Because what they don't wanna have happen is, let's say you get foreclosed upon and the bank goes, cool, we take everything now. Like, no, no, no, no, no. We still have a right to this revenue. The bank can't have that, so theirs needs to be in a senior position to the bank.

Speaker 4: Okay? Which

Speaker: they're like, if you do it as a simultaneous close.

Like, they're like, we're fine. Like we can insert it. Banks are cool with it 'cause everyone knows what's happening here. We've all signed off on it. Yeah. If you've already closed, bought it and then you go to the bank and say, Hey, this needs to happen. There's a very special, a form where essentially the bank needs to give permission to for them to be ahead of them.

Which I go, it's fine. It's a standard practice, but like. Not every bank is used to doing that. Yeah. And knows what they're doing and like it's a thing. Hmm. And so doing a simultaneous close, like is harder on one level. 'cause it's like, okay, we got multiple people all coming together at the same time.

Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: But in some ways it's easier because everyone's on the same page right out the gate Yeah. Of what's going on. And from what it sounds like, a lot of 'em like to have like two months to close. They can do it in a month. And apparently if you are like Johnny on the spot, have all the paperwork done, like it can be done in two weeks.

Well, yeah. 'cause I, I mean, which still like never happens. Nothing is really

Speaker 2: changing necessarily. It's all paperwork material. It's just paperwork saying Yeah. And getting lawyers to where are going sign

Speaker: off on stuff and go, yeah, this all looks good. Right. So yeah, it's kind of a. It's wild west, man. That's like, it's interesting.

It's this weird, well, it is a wild west and it's also this turns out it's this. It's a thing. Sub industry that is pretty normal and yeah. Oh, and how about this? You can have brokers who represent buyers. Just like agents representing buyers and sellers. Okay. But then put two people together. So like I've talked to some where I'm like, Hey, I'm looking to sell this.

And they go, sweet. I'll go talk to a bunch of buyers. I'll get a bunch of quotes back from them. Right. Send 'em to you. Tell me who you're interested in. We'll take the next steps from there. And then they get a commission from that buyer. Not, or for me. I guess some from somebody. Right. The transaction for connecting us together on

Speaker 2: some, on some side.

They get a commission. Yeah.

Speaker: So there's that too.

Speaker 2: If you had to estimate, and none

Speaker: of 'em are local, by the way. This

Speaker 2: is like a random question. Okay. If you had to estimate how many cell tower, not cell tower leases necessarily, how many cell towers existed? Like in Oregon and then in the us. Oh, geez. Like, well,

Speaker: what I can tell is that, how many are we talking about?

I know one company owns 2,500 Worldwide. Another one owns, or whatever controls Uhhuh. A thousand of them in the US alone. Alright. I mean, there's a lot of 'em out there. There's a lot of 'em. Yeah. Huh. And that's just two.

Speaker 2: Yeah. There's hundreds of these companies probably. Yeah.

Speaker: I would not be shocked to find out that there's like a hundred thousand cell towers.

Oh. In the world because

Speaker 2: like for a, for a particular cell tower, what's the typical range that it like? Covers? I have no idea. I have no idea. I guess that maybe depends on,

Speaker: yeah. What I do know is when I flew my drone up at the building to take pictures of it all legal, by the way, we're all good. When I got near the towers, I'd struggled to connect to my radio.

It definitely had some sort of interference going on signal, and I would lose signal and then the drone would be like going back to home. I'm like,

Speaker 3: no. And then it would stay up. It was stay up.

Speaker: So, there's, it's interesting. I don't, I don't know. Yeah. Yeah, it's a lot. What was the other oh shoot.

I was gonna share something. I forgot now. But yeah, it's just interesting. It's an interesting, it's an interesting world for sure. If

Speaker 2: you own a tall building. Seems like something you would wanna know about.

Speaker: Yeah. What's, so if it was me, if I own a tall building a I'D research, you know, I'd reach out to the different carriers and see what they're at, or reach out to some of these other companies.

Mm-hmm. And be like, Hey, I'm interested in doing this. Do you want a partner? Like, I'll give you the easement, and then you go off and. Figure all that stuff out.

Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: And I think it's a real possibility for the size of it. Or if you own a piece of land and you're like, yeah, let's build a tower here. My word, you know, especially if you're somewhere where coverage stinks.

Speaker 2: Yeah,

Speaker: man, there's true opportunity there for sure. Yes is true. Companies are, companies are interested in this. Oh, I remember now what I was gonna say, another factor here that I'm trying to consider is so Elon Musk's, SpaceX mm-hmm. Has starlink. Which is a satellite version of cell connectiveness. Okay.

And so the question is like, everyone had a landline. That was awesome.

Speaker 2: Yep.

Speaker: Now those are slowly becoming less important and everyone's moving over to these cell towers. Yep. The question is, in 20 years are people gonna be like, oh yeah, we just have satellite. Mm-hmm. And we get worldwide coverage wherever we're at.

No big deal. Yep. And so that obviously will affect the value of these cell towers. Mm-hmm. That turns out to be a thing in the future. Now obviously cell companies are trying to do what they can to remain relevant and like, you know, be like, we're better than them, which is fine. Like as they should for now,

Speaker 2: it probably is, but yeah, like you're saying, technology will advance to a point where it's no longer better.

So Yeah,

Speaker: or it's just, you go, yeah, I don't know. It's very straight. It's very fascinating how all that, like, how it all plays into it. I can see

Speaker 2: how that plays into the term of your lease too. You know, if you're like,

Speaker: wow, yeah, hundred percent technology's

Speaker 2: gonna change. I want the sugar timeline for the lease.

You

Speaker: know, so, so, so there you go. That's what I've been learning about cell tower stuff. Wow. And how to kind of look at it from an investor standpoint. Yeah. They're not just these, so next time you're in the air and you see, or like you're in the air, next time you see one up in the air, you know, you should be able to think like, oh yes, that is leased by someone, but not necessarily by the land owner.

And there is opportunity out there, if you like, if you know someone. Who has like, who has a cell tower and a lease on it. Like you can talk to 'em like, Hey, I'd be happy to help you find somebody, and you can get a little commission out of that. I don't know what the, I, I think it falls outside the, the regular rules of real estates, estate commissions.

Who, but I don't know. But yeah, man, it's a, it is a crazy world and one where. Again, even if you're looking at a building that has cell towers, this is something that you can think about in terms of the acquisition and how to go about it. Yeah. You just gotta make sure you give yourself enough timelines and get everyone on the same page, especially your lender.

Yeah. On what's going on. So, so yeah. Man, that's that's cell towers. Cool. It's crazy. It's crazy. I probably, I spent multiple hours on the phone today talking with people. Get like finalizing details, figuring it all out. Yeah. It is it's sounds like a process. Yes, it is a process. I've been working on it for like a month and so so that's the other one is like, give yourself time to figure it out.

'cause there's just, the learning curve is unbelievable. Gordon, I still don't know everything. I would get it, but there you go. But but there you are. And so if you enjoyed this podcast, we'd love it if you gave it a thumbs up wherever it is that you listen. And if you are interested in learning about investing with us in things like this type of project and other fun stuff you can check us out at furlo.com.

Thanks for listening. Have a great day.